In the wake of a major vaping regulation overhaul in France, Claude Bamberger joins us to uncover the extent of the new disposable vape ban and where this leaves people who want to quit smoking.
Transcription:
00:05
Joanna Junak: Hello and welcome. I'm Joanna Junak and this is GFN News on GFN.tv. France has become the second European country after Belgium to prohibit the sale of disposable e-cigarettes. The decision follows increasing global concerns over the growing popularity of e-cigarettes and similar devices, which are frequently advertised as a less harmful option than traditional smoke. Claude Bamberger, president of the French Independent Association of Electronic Cigarette Users, is with us today to provide insights into the situation in the country regarding the ban on nicotine products. Hello Claude. France has followed Belgium in banning disposable e-cigarettes. Can you explain the key reasons behind this decision to us?
01:19
Claude Bamberger: The blunt reasons were originality in a moral panic based on a skewed survey and green MPs trying to show something done and influenced by some NGOs who done the survey. Officially, the reasons were environment, but strangely only a fraction of these disposable batteries that are the subject of the EU directive. So it's strange not to anticipate the directive for all batteries. I learned that there were far more new batteries every year than I thought, and far more than any disposable vapes market in France. And the second reason was health, which we don't agree on.
02:18
Joanna Junak: And besides disposable e-cigarettes, has France decided to ban any other nicotine products?
02:26
Claude Bamberger: The minister said they want to ban other basically all non-pharmaceutical nicotine products, except refillable vapes, of course, and cartridges. But they don't explain how. because it's not an executive decision. And they don't explain on what the grounds, except fake news, of course. And it's important to remember that the disposable thing. It was a law that was voted years ago in fact. But we changed assembly and everything. So basically it just re-past recently. But it's a two or three years old decision from the legislative part. So we don't really see how And basically, anybody, any seller or provider of those products could prosecute the decision, of course. We don't know if they would.
03:49
Joanna Junak: You mentioned banning all non-pharmaceutical nicotine products. Does that mean nicotine patches as well?
03:58
Claude Bamberger: They just listed any non-pharmaceutical nicotine products except vapes, and we already banned those. So it's every exit door to smoking except pharmaceutical ones, knowing that we don't have a varicline anymore, because Pfizer decided to shut it down. And we don't have a cytizine. So basically, there is only NRTs and psychological help. and other like it. I mean, the most efficient.
04:47
Joanna Junak: Looking at all these decisions, what do tobacco harm reduction activists think? Do they oppose the ban?
04:57
Claude Bamberger: We don't oppose strictly the ban because we don't really like disposable waste for the environmental reasons, but also because they are expensive for people. They are too, consider they are too expensive. But we don't agree that it's based on science because there is no scientific reason, health reasons to ban them. And it's lacking accompanying measures for real users to have options because you have current users and I help people quit smoking online and we see people asking how can I switch to something else? There is no path lined up for them in the society or in the messages from the ministry. So, yeah, they are just smokers abandoned. And there are real questions. For example, we have old people that discovered vape with disposable because they have issues manipulating the refillable products. Some of them go to cartridges. But the issue is that the offer on the market is small. So some of them I think mostly the youngest one will go to what is already The main products we see, which are already the illegal, bigger disposable, with more than two milliliters, so not regulated ones. So we try to help people find a path, but it's not that easy for all of them. Most of them are older people, younger people they can. They have the dexterity to use refillable vapes. with all the people that have issues. And sadly, the reason for pollution nobody talks about, it's the ones that don't vape. And it's closing a door for them to discover vape. What we see in the figures is that mostly people discover experiment with disposable vapes. Some non-regular users some of them smokers, they buy a disposable for a week or two. That begins to be understandable. But regular users don’t stick with it. It's not economically viable.
07:57
Joanna Junak: And are there any specific groups of people who could be most affected by this decision?
08:06
Claude Bamberger: Like I said, mostly smokers that have issues with refillable vapes. And we would prefer a better offer in the public market with more choices, better taste, less expensive products as well for those people. And I was personally surprised by the success of disposable That's expensive and that's not very good products. But I think it showed there is a place where there is a market for easy to use vapes for beginners and for both to other products, of course. But the people that are using that are basically smokers or wannabe smokers. And I prefer when I have smokers to vape and smokers to have options to try easy vape and say, oh yeah, that's for me. And I can go through a path to use a refillable vape and then even other products if they want.
09:24
Joanna Junak: Claude, in your opinion, where could these bans lead to?
09:33
Claude Bamberger: as teen sales are already illegal, as they already buy unregulated vapes, bigger vapes that are less expensive for the use, I think illegal market first, and then smoking. Basically, if you If you think of a tobacconist in France, you must go to a tobacconist to buy tobacco. If a tobacconist sells a disposable vape to smokers, adult smokers, it risks 100,000 euros. If he sells cigarettes to a minor, He risked 135 euros. Basically, it means something for the market. So I think illegal market and cigarettes, of course.
10:44
Joanna Junak: Okay. And looking at all the decisions being made around Europe, what goals has the European Union set for reducing smoking by 2040?
10:58
Claude Bamberger: But they seem to be well-organized to fail. I did not understand that in the past, that failing is easy in policies. And you can't reproach somebody doing something, and then you will say, oh, sorry, I failed. Basically, cutting down already the dosage, more than 20 milligrams, and not acknowledging that this pharmaceutical monopoly is a failure and a voluntary failure from the pharmaceutical industry. They just shut down doors for people to quit smoking or to avoid smoking altogether. I mean, the most difficult thing is quitting smoking. We all know the idea is don't begin. A good way not to begin is to do something else. People smoke, we see that all over the place. So avoiding all nicotine is double failure.
12:17
Joanna Junak: Thank you, Claude. That's all for today. Tune in next time here on GFN TV or on our podcast. And make sure to check out our social media pages for the latest updates on this year's Global Forum on Nicotine Conference. Thanks for watching or listening. See you next time.